. Take a listen at andregiroux.com I've setup samples on home page. You can compare to where I recorded my fisrt CD A Long Time Comin in a $3,000,000 studio. Let me know what you think. And while your there don't be shy you can sign my guessbook.Can't wait to see results
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André Giroux
- Posts: 290
- Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:45 pm
Can't wait to see results
I've recorded 1 cd Deep-Rooted with MTS 3.11 and I was quite pleased with the results. Can't wait to see the result with 4.1 on my new instrumental flatpicking album . Take a listen at andregiroux.com I've setup samples on home page. You can compare to where I recorded my fisrt CD A Long Time Comin in a $3,000,000 studio. Let me know what you think. And while your there don't be shy you can sign my guessbook.
. Take a listen at andregiroux.com I've setup samples on home page. You can compare to where I recorded my fisrt CD A Long Time Comin in a $3,000,000 studio. Let me know what you think. And while your there don't be shy you can sign my guessbook.Hi Andr? !
I listened to some cuts from "A Long Time Comin'" and "Deep-Rooted" on your site. You have some good material on both!
While MTS isn't designed to compete with a $3,000,000 studio, the results on "Deep-Rooted" are pretty good and I think better mastering would narrow the gap considerably.
Let us know when "Frets of Fire" is released.
I listened to some cuts from "A Long Time Comin'" and "Deep-Rooted" on your site. You have some good material on both!
While MTS isn't designed to compete with a $3,000,000 studio, the results on "Deep-Rooted" are pretty good and I think better mastering would narrow the gap considerably.
Let us know when "Frets of Fire" is released.
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André Giroux
- Posts: 290
- Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:45 pm
Hi Saz,Saz wrote:Hi Andr? !
I listened to some cuts from "A Long Time Comin'" and "Deep-Rooted" on your site. You have some good material on both!
While MTS isn't designed to compete with a $3,000,000 studio, the results on "Deep-Rooted" are pretty good and I think better mastering would narrow the gap considerably.
Let us know when "Frets of Fire" is released.
Thanks for checking it out. I'm happy with what came out MTS. Now with this new version 4.01 MTS and that I'm more familiar on how it work I really can't wait hear the results on Frets Of Fire. It should be done early in the new year.
Hi Andre,
Nice soundin' good ole Bluegrass there, made me pick up the old flattop and jam along on tune example number one.
"Walkin' in Jerusalem" YasSUH!
I'm just an old bebopper that spent time playing bluegrass while learning as a lad.
You'd be fun ta jam with, man.
Nice stuff.
Hey Saz! -- He all raht fo' a white boy wit' shoes on, man!
A good Mastering job would put your recordings over the top.
--Mac
Nice soundin' good ole Bluegrass there, made me pick up the old flattop and jam along on tune example number one.
"Walkin' in Jerusalem" YasSUH!
I'm just an old bebopper that spent time playing bluegrass while learning as a lad.
You'd be fun ta jam with, man.
Nice stuff.
Hey Saz! -- He all raht fo' a white boy wit' shoes on, man!
A good Mastering job would put your recordings over the top.
--Mac
He should seriously consider investing in better converters before starting the next project, you are correct.Robomusic wrote:I must admit that the quality is a bit off, but still very good, i can hear a bit more depth in the pro recording, that may be due as Mac said to just some more effort in the mastering, but also in the bit depth and sample rate of the computer recordings, head room is everything it seems.
But the good news is that he can pick up an EMU "M" series card for pennies on the dollar and have the very same convertors that the big boys pay thousands for with the Protools stuff. No brainer in my book. Just do it.
--Mac
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André Giroux
- Posts: 290
- Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:45 pm
I recorded at 24 bits and converted the master to 16 bits of course to burn it to CD and then converted to MP3 for the internet. I'm not quite sure what you guys are saying, it is a bit cleaner and more powerful in wave files on the CD itself than what you hear on my website. Can you explain more in details what you mean by bit depth and head room and what you would change in the mastering. I'm curious.Mac wrote:He should seriously consider investing in better converters before starting the next project, you are correct.Robomusic wrote:I must admit that the quality is a bit off, but still very good, i can hear a bit more depth in the pro recording, that may be due as Mac said to just some more effort in the mastering, but also in the bit depth and sample rate of the computer recordings, head room is everything it seems.
But the good news is that he can pick up an EMU "M" series card for pennies on the dollar and have the very same convertors that the big boys pay thousands for with the Protools stuff. No brainer in my book. Just do it.
--Mac
Hi again, Andre
Mastering can cover a lot of ground. Takes someone with both knowledge of technique plus ears of gold. A thorough knowledge of music and of how many different instruments should sound is important, too IMO. I'm one of those Mastering Engineer geeks, btw.
You will find as many techniques as you will find Mastering Engineers, it seems, too. Some of us even might elect to take the project out of the digital domain and pass it through some analog gear if necessary. All depends upon how each track sounds. EQ, light soft knee compression, sometimes more comprehensive tools are called for such as the multi-band compressor or parametric EQ, too. All depends upon how the tracks sound. GOOD MASTERING TAKE TIME. It also takes the kind of person who is very very very picky and will take the time to correct every little thing found on the tracks. It cannot be done properly with the so-called "mastering software" or "mastering plugin", posh. Ad hype. Of course, lots of kiddies and even older kiddies are only interested in making it loud, loud, loud. The automatic plugin would do that but that is not the true goal of music reproduction or at least it shouldn't be. We want to guarantee a good sound when the disk is used in all sorts of different equipment. We want to guarantee a GREAT audio experience when the disk is played on high end equipment at the same time. And we want it "ready for airplay". Yes, there are design standards for such, too.
There is another side to the Mastering, also, and that has to do with making sure that the final copy doesn't violate any of the standards involved. No amplitude overruns, because that is the kiss of death in digital audio, a few other things having to do with specific frequencies.
As for converters, the ones I'm talking about are the hardware converters that are in our soundcard or sound device that the signal from your microphones is passed through. The converters job here is to convert analog signal to digital. Two things are very important about the converter and they are the internal design of the converter device itself and the clock that drives it. "Jitter free" clocks are the ideal type, and of course they cost more money to implement.
Right now there is exactly one converter chip that is the ultimate. Until somebody comes up with another design, all the other converter chips of lesser design (and thus lower cost) are what you will find in any of the consumer, pro-sumer and even in a lot of higher end sound devices.
Up until recently, obtaining a high quality converter and clock was an expensive proposition for the home recordist, typically costing more than everything else in the average home studio put together.
Until EMU introduced their new "Creative Professional" series of soundcards that have the "M" at the end of their model numbers.
The price is unbelievably low for what you get in signal quality, too.
Anybody who is targeting a CD release should seriously consider this card before starting the project IMO.
One more thing -- you shouldn't try to master your own project. The familiarity that you have with the sound from doing the playing, tracking, editing and mixdown will get right in your way, dig.
I'm not saying it is impossible to do, just saying that you shouldn't attempt it if best results are your goal. And why shouldn't best possible results be the goal?
--Mac
Mastering can cover a lot of ground. Takes someone with both knowledge of technique plus ears of gold. A thorough knowledge of music and of how many different instruments should sound is important, too IMO. I'm one of those Mastering Engineer geeks, btw.
You will find as many techniques as you will find Mastering Engineers, it seems, too. Some of us even might elect to take the project out of the digital domain and pass it through some analog gear if necessary. All depends upon how each track sounds. EQ, light soft knee compression, sometimes more comprehensive tools are called for such as the multi-band compressor or parametric EQ, too. All depends upon how the tracks sound. GOOD MASTERING TAKE TIME. It also takes the kind of person who is very very very picky and will take the time to correct every little thing found on the tracks. It cannot be done properly with the so-called "mastering software" or "mastering plugin", posh. Ad hype. Of course, lots of kiddies and even older kiddies are only interested in making it loud, loud, loud. The automatic plugin would do that but that is not the true goal of music reproduction or at least it shouldn't be. We want to guarantee a good sound when the disk is used in all sorts of different equipment. We want to guarantee a GREAT audio experience when the disk is played on high end equipment at the same time. And we want it "ready for airplay". Yes, there are design standards for such, too.
There is another side to the Mastering, also, and that has to do with making sure that the final copy doesn't violate any of the standards involved. No amplitude overruns, because that is the kiss of death in digital audio, a few other things having to do with specific frequencies.
As for converters, the ones I'm talking about are the hardware converters that are in our soundcard or sound device that the signal from your microphones is passed through. The converters job here is to convert analog signal to digital. Two things are very important about the converter and they are the internal design of the converter device itself and the clock that drives it. "Jitter free" clocks are the ideal type, and of course they cost more money to implement.
Right now there is exactly one converter chip that is the ultimate. Until somebody comes up with another design, all the other converter chips of lesser design (and thus lower cost) are what you will find in any of the consumer, pro-sumer and even in a lot of higher end sound devices.
Up until recently, obtaining a high quality converter and clock was an expensive proposition for the home recordist, typically costing more than everything else in the average home studio put together.
Until EMU introduced their new "Creative Professional" series of soundcards that have the "M" at the end of their model numbers.
The price is unbelievably low for what you get in signal quality, too.
Anybody who is targeting a CD release should seriously consider this card before starting the project IMO.
One more thing -- you shouldn't try to master your own project. The familiarity that you have with the sound from doing the playing, tracking, editing and mixdown will get right in your way, dig.
I'm not saying it is impossible to do, just saying that you shouldn't attempt it if best results are your goal. And why shouldn't best possible results be the goal?
--Mac
As usual, Mac is right on the money.
For some real-life before and after examples of Mastering, check this page... http://home.columbus.rr.com/fcbmastering/download.htm It's something that rarely gets heard.
For some further reading on Mastering, here's a few links...
http://www.musicbizacademy.com/articles ... tering.htm
http://www.digido.com/portal/pmodule_id ... age_id=38/
For some real-life before and after examples of Mastering, check this page... http://home.columbus.rr.com/fcbmastering/download.htm It's something that rarely gets heard.
For some further reading on Mastering, here's a few links...
http://www.musicbizacademy.com/articles ... tering.htm
http://www.digido.com/portal/pmodule_id ... age_id=38/
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André Giroux
- Posts: 290
- Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:45 pm
Hey guys.Saz wrote:As usual, Mac is right on the money.
For some real-life before and after examples of Mastering, check this page... http://home.columbus.rr.com/fcbmastering/download.htm It's something that rarely gets heard.
For some further reading on Mastering, here's a few links...
http://www.musicbizacademy.com/articles ... tering.htm
http://www.digido.com/portal/pmodule_id ... age_id=38/
Thanks alot for pointers and knowledge. Good advise is always good to have
Robomusic wrote:Mac i have been really looking at the E-MU stuff, and I am curious as to what you front that with? As in what interface do you use to send the sound to the sound card, just the one that comes with it, or are you connecting to a mackie or another mixer?
So far all I have used is the inputs that come on the 1616M.
I've got plenty of other options around here, including the ole Mackie VLZ board plus a small plethora of those little mic pres, some with tubes in 'em some not and then there's my old home built all tube all powerful mic preamp that is based on a combination of about three well known designs.
I bought this model because it was designed primarily for laptop use. Lugging a mixer along would seem to defeat much of my purpose actually (grin).
But let me tell you about the two Mic preamps that come built into the 1616M. They are an all new design for EMU and are a cut above the preamps that come with any of the other EMU cards, they are solid state, transparent, and best of all, sound very good indeed with a variety of mics.
Most of the time my stuff is a "one man show" anymore, so I don't have need for multiple inputs all that much. Occasionally I get a request to go out somewhere and record something on location and for that I would grab my 828MKII firewire if called today anyway. The 1616M can take more inputs through its digital ports, a lot of people are using the little Behringer A-D unit for that (yuck, what a thing to put alongside those M converters) I guess money is the reason or the lack thereof.
About big mixers in home recording studios:
I find that I don't need one all that much.
Those who feel they need the big mixer with all the knobs and faders for whatever reason are certainly not in a bad position, so don't take offense with me here please.
I just have always used as few active devices as possible in my signal chain at all times on the theory that each active device has got to add at least a minimal amount of thermal noise if nothing else, and if that device does not have a raison d'etre that is necessary to get the job done, that device is superfluous in my signal chain.
Plugging a super high quality mic preamp through a mixer for no other reason than to get the signal into the Line Input of your sound device or for "convenience" doesn't make sense to me. That is what a Patch Bay is for.
Of course, bear in mind that 99% of my work is of the "one man show" variety. If I have to mic up a drumkit or a small ensemble who wish to perform all at once and not overdub or otherwise multitrack out of realtime, then the mixer suddenly does have a reason to exist in the signal chain.
There are plenty of ways to skin that cat, each thing you do should have a well founded REASON, IMO.
Then of course there are the testosterone-poisoned, who simply must have all those knobs and faders and a well lit meter bridge for the look of the thing. That's another set of design rules entirely.
--Mac
Yeah i am looking at the 1828M system to go with a new rack computer that is in the works soon, i want to put it in a nice carring case and for hauling around if needed. Then i sometimes think that a Lappy would even be better, given the new features that come with the E-MU system like the sampler and effects. I am a one man show as well, so maybe a system like yours would be nice, PC Club makes a nice Lappy with 7200 rpm hard drive and lots of ram, that one of the managers there said she uses for recording. yummy sounding with the 1616M
If you are in the position of being able to buy a new lappy for use with the 1616M, do your homework carefully.
While EMU now states that the card will "work" with all chipsets and pcmcia controllers, pay attention to the pcmcia controller type on any laptops you are considering.
The difference is that certain pcmcia controllers won't allow as many inputs as others.
The "unofficial EMU forum" is the source for what is working, what is working well, and what is not working at all.
Unfortunately, the pcmcia controller is not something that most laptop mfr's list in their specifications to be easily found. You have to be able to get into the Device Manager and look to see which controller the laptop is designed around. In my recent search I was not very successful with emails to the larger laptop mfr's in getting someone to reply with this information, finally resorting to calling a retail store and asking someone if they could actually walk over to the laptop on display and look at the Device Manager for me. Gift of gab helps. Turns out they didn't even know how to get to Device Manager so I talked 'em through it over the phone.
Even after finding out that my choice used the Texas Instruments "PCIxx21" pcmcia driver there was still a time of breath holding, for nobody else on the unofficial EMU forum had tried that particular controller yet. At this point I know it works, but haven't had the time to hook up all inputs and outputs to see if that works, too. Fingers crossed on that front. Most of the time I will only be using one input or one stereo input at a time anyway (grin) but there are those moments when you need to go to church and record the choir, or a band on location and need to have all of the advertised 16 inputs available. Remember, 8 of those inputs are digital. To use them requires the use of an ADAT or separate standalone A-D.
Find out about that 7200rpm hard drive, too. Don't get one that has only a 2mb buffer. Unbelievable that anyone would even build a 7200 like that, but have run into that in my search. You want the 8mb buffer. In my case I went with a stock config 5400rpm with 8mb buffer as that was a lot less money and time wait than asking HP to custom install a Hitachi 7200. So far so good, but I'm ready to swap out that drive for an aftermarket purchased Hitachi 7200 w/8mb cache if there are any problems. Planning to stream to external FireWire drive box that I dropped a Maxtor 7200 w/16mb cache into anyway...
Anyway, the platform seems nice so far, I think they could have put more money into some of the jacks on the thing, people are already complaining about these breaking, so I'm being super careful when patching. Guess at this price level you don't get hi-rel gummint surplus jacks. Doesn't bother me that much, for if these plastic jacks start giving it up I'll just open that box up and do some warranty voiding jack replacement hee hee.
--Mac
While EMU now states that the card will "work" with all chipsets and pcmcia controllers, pay attention to the pcmcia controller type on any laptops you are considering.
The difference is that certain pcmcia controllers won't allow as many inputs as others.
The "unofficial EMU forum" is the source for what is working, what is working well, and what is not working at all.
Unfortunately, the pcmcia controller is not something that most laptop mfr's list in their specifications to be easily found. You have to be able to get into the Device Manager and look to see which controller the laptop is designed around. In my recent search I was not very successful with emails to the larger laptop mfr's in getting someone to reply with this information, finally resorting to calling a retail store and asking someone if they could actually walk over to the laptop on display and look at the Device Manager for me. Gift of gab helps. Turns out they didn't even know how to get to Device Manager so I talked 'em through it over the phone.
Even after finding out that my choice used the Texas Instruments "PCIxx21" pcmcia driver there was still a time of breath holding, for nobody else on the unofficial EMU forum had tried that particular controller yet. At this point I know it works, but haven't had the time to hook up all inputs and outputs to see if that works, too. Fingers crossed on that front. Most of the time I will only be using one input or one stereo input at a time anyway (grin) but there are those moments when you need to go to church and record the choir, or a band on location and need to have all of the advertised 16 inputs available. Remember, 8 of those inputs are digital. To use them requires the use of an ADAT or separate standalone A-D.
Find out about that 7200rpm hard drive, too. Don't get one that has only a 2mb buffer. Unbelievable that anyone would even build a 7200 like that, but have run into that in my search. You want the 8mb buffer. In my case I went with a stock config 5400rpm with 8mb buffer as that was a lot less money and time wait than asking HP to custom install a Hitachi 7200. So far so good, but I'm ready to swap out that drive for an aftermarket purchased Hitachi 7200 w/8mb cache if there are any problems. Planning to stream to external FireWire drive box that I dropped a Maxtor 7200 w/16mb cache into anyway...
Anyway, the platform seems nice so far, I think they could have put more money into some of the jacks on the thing, people are already complaining about these breaking, so I'm being super careful when patching. Guess at this price level you don't get hi-rel gummint surplus jacks. Doesn't bother me that much, for if these plastic jacks start giving it up I'll just open that box up and do some warranty voiding jack replacement hee hee.
--Mac